Christians! Don't believe the deviant Paul; have faith in Jesus who travelled to India after the event of Crucifixion

Paarsurrey says:

Hi Christians!

Please don’t believe the deviant Paul; have faith in Jesus who travelled to india after the event of Crucifixion to complete his mission towards lost sheep or Lost Ten Tribes of Israel who were settled there.Kindly see hereunder his probable route of travel. This is supported by history also.

For details kindly access:

here

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

whitemunara@yahoo.com


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If the soldiers were asleep they could be very well asked how they came to know in their sleep that the corpse of Jesus had been stolen away

I wrote today following post to: christchurch@christchurchreformed.com

Hi

I write further to my post dated 9/7/08:

Promised Messiah 1835-1908 Says:

It was the same body, with wounds on it, which had been saved from death; and, as there was still the fear of the Jews, Jesus, making use of all precautions, left the land. All talk of anything contrary to this is absurd — as the one about the Jews having bribed the soldiers in order to make them say that the disciples had stolen the corpse while they (the soldiers) were asleep.

If the soldiers were asleep they could be very well asked how they came to know in their sleep that the corpse of Jesus had been stolen away. From the mere fact of Jesus not being in the tomb, can anybody in reason believe that he had gone up to heaven? May there not be other causes as a result of which tombs might remain empty. At the time of going up to heaven, it was up to Jesus to meet a few hundred Jews, and also Pilate.

Whom was he afraid of in his glorious body. He did not care to furnish his opponents with the slightest proof. On the contrary, he took fright and fled to Galilee. That is why we positively believe that though it is true that he left the tomb, a chamber with an opening, and though it is true that he secretly met the disciples, yet it is not true that he was given any new and glorious body; it was the same body, and the same wounds, and there was the same fear in his heart lest the accursed Jews arrest him again.

Just read attentively Matthew, chapter 28, verses 7 to 10. These verses clearly say that the women who were told by someone that Jesus was alive and was going to Galilee, and who were also told quietly that they should inform the disciples, were no doubt pleased to hear this, but they went with a terrified heart, — they were still afraid lest Jesus might still be caught by some wicked Jew. The ninth verse says, that while these women were on their way to inform the disciples, Jesus met and saluted them. The tenth verse says that Jesus asked them not to be afraid, i.e. of his being caught; he asked them to inform his brethren that they should all go to Galilee22; that they would see him there, i.e., he could not stay there for fear of the enemy.

In short, if Jesus had really come to life after his death and had assumed a glorious body, it was up to him to furnish proof of such life to the Jews. But we know that he did not do this. It is absurd, therefore, to accuse the Jews of trying to render negatory the proof of Jesus’ coming to life again. No, Jesus himself has not given the slightest proof of his restoration to life; rather, by his secret flight, by the fact of his taking food, and sleep, and exhibiting his wounds, he himself proved that he did not die on the Cross.

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch1.html



Paarsurrey says:



I thank you for your resposnes/comments.

One should form one’s own unbiased opinion with research and should accept the truth where-ever it comes from.

My Christian friends are welcome for their comments; even if they differ with me.

Regards

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim









--- On Sun, 9/7/08, White Munara wrote:

From: White Munara

Subject: Why and what for; So many wrappings on Jesus?

To: christchurch@christchurchreformed.com

Date: Sunday, September 7, 2008, 6:33 AM

Why and what for; So many wrappings on Jesus?



Hi



Kindly let the wrappings of Jesus tell the story if Jesus died a cursed death on Cross or he survived as he had earlier prophesised and he migrated from Jerusalem and went to the East to spread his teachings in the ten tribes of the house of Israel who were settled there.



The question to start with is; why Jesus was wrapped into in the first place? The wrappings speak that the persons who wrapped him were sure that Jesus had not died on the Cross.



A dead body needs no wrappings whatsoever.The body of a dead person is covered with a shroud that is the Jewish, Christian and Muslim tradition I think. The dead body is given a bath or washed and is wrapped into a shroud/s.The final funeral ceremony is held, and it is placed in the grave.



Please quote from some Jewish, Christian and Muslim sources if I am wrong.



1. When and where Jesus was given a bath or his body was washed.



2. Did the disciples ,who had fled away from the scene of crucifixion, were informed of the funeral ceremony? If not, why not?



3. Who lead the funeral prayer?

4. Was funeral ceremony held in Jewish tradition or Christian tradition? Christian tradition was invented later by Paul or his church unauthorized. Jesus had given no such tradition.



If those who were trusted with the body of Jesus did not participate or arrange the above; and we find no such recorded account in the four gospels, it is sure those who looked after his body knew that Jesus was not dead and hence they did not do it.



The injured body always needs wrappings after application of the ointments or medicines in the garb of fragrances.



I think the rest is very clear. Those who wrapped Jesus; they are the ones or their helping friends who are supposed to unwrap him. If they could put him in a tomb and placed a stone on the opining; they could help Jesus to push the stone away, unwrap him and let him go.



This is very reasonable. I think you agree with me.



I love Jesus and Muhammad.



Thanks



I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim



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Paul accepts the absurdity of Pauline/Christian faith; if Jesus did not die on Cross

Paarsurrey says:

Jesus did not die a cursed death on Cross


And hence, therefore, there is no Jesus’ resurrection from the dead. The entire Christian myth is based on this belief. Our CatholicProtestant friends have rightly acknowledged the logic behind this in words of no less a person than Paul who happened to invent this theological philosophy at Rome when Jesus was alive but on his way to India; Jesus was in exile.

This point, that if there is no Jesus’ death on cross, there is no resurrection from the dead and divinity of Jesus gets falsifiedis well established by the following website:

http://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/resurrection-of-christ.htm

And we quote:

“Resurrection of Christ - Establishing the Importance

The resurrection of Christ is the linchpin of the Christian faith — the historical event upon which Christian doctrine stands or falls. The apostle Paul makes this clear in his first letter to the Corinthians: But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. And if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is futile and your faith is empty. … For if only in this life we have hope in Christ, we should be pitied more than anyone (1 Cor. 15:13-14, 19).”

The things were like this till GodAllahYHWH revealed the truth on Mirza Ghulam Ahmad Quadiani 1835-1908 that Jesus son of Mary had died and that he was the PromisedMessiah. The Second Coming of Jesus has taken place in his person metaphorically, and no one else would be coming literally and physically.

With this he was informed of the arguments of Jesus not dieing on Cross; from Quran, NTBible, History, and Medical etc. The evidences already existed in these scriptures only these were hidden from the eyes. The PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 brought them into the light and now everyone could see them. In fact this is the doctrine on which rests the peace of the world. Jews, Christians and Muslim have stakes in it.

The PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 has explained himself the importance of Jesus not dieing on Cross in his book “Jesus in India”:

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/index.html

I have written this book, so that, by adducing proofs from established facts, from conclusive historical evidence of proved value and from ancient documents of non-Muslims, I might remove the serious misconceptions which are current among Muslims and among most Christian sects regarding the earlier and the later life of Jesus (on whom be peace) - misconceptions, the dangerous implications of which have not only injured and destroyed the conception of Divine Unity, but the unwholesome and poisonous influence of which has for long been noticed in the morals of the Muslims of this country. Spiritual maladies, i.e., want of good morals, evil thoughts, callousness, want of sympathy, are spreading among most Islamic sects, being the result of beliefs in unfounded stories and anecdotes of this kind. Human sympathy, pity and love of justice, humility and humble-mindedness - all good qualities - are disappearing day by day, as if they will soon bid a last farewell to this community.

This callousness and this immorality make many a Muslim appear no better than the beasts of the jungle. A Jain or a Buddhist is afraid of and avoids killing even a mosquito or a flea, but, alas! there are many among us Muslims who, while they kill an innocent man or commit wanton murder, are not afraid of the powerful God, who rates human life higher than that of all the animals.

What is this callousness and cruelty and want of sympathy due to? It is due to this - that from their very childhood, stories and anecdotes and wrong views of the doctrine of Jihad are dinned into their ears and inculcated into their hearts, the result being that gradually they become morally dead and cease to feel the heinousness of their hateful actions; nay, rather, the man who murders another man unawares and thus brings ruin to the murdered man’s family thinks that he has done a meritorious deed; or rather, that he has made the most of an opportunity to win favour with his community.

As no lectures or sermons are delivered in our country to stop such evils - and if there are any such lectures they have an element of hypocrisy in them - the common people think approvingly of such misdeeds. Accordingly, taking pity upon my own people, I have compiled several books in Urdu, Persian and Arabic, in which I have stated that the popular view of Jihad prevalent among Muslims, that is, the expectation of a bloody Imam, full of spite and hostility for other people, is a texture of false beliefs inculcated by shortsighted Ulema; otherwise, Islam does not allow the use of the sword for the Faith; except in the case of defensive wars, or in the case of wars waged to punish a tyrant or to uphold freedom.

The need of a defensive war arises when the aggression of an adversary threatens one’s own life. These are the three kinds of Jihad permitted by the Shariat, and, apart from these three kinds, there is no other kind of war which is permitted by Islam for the propagation of the Faith.

http://www.alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/intro.html

The Christian friend are welcome to comment; even if they differ with me.

I am ah Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Deviant Paul invented Christian religious philosophy on Jesus death on Cross; unknown to Jesus

Paarsurrey says:

There is no evidence based on secular history sources confirming that Jesus died a cursed death on Cross.

Needless to mention that Josepus was not alive in the time of Jesus to qualify for a firsthand testimony; more so, as the whole Christian mythology invented by Paul was based on this single point;unknown to Jesus himself.

The Christians please read the following excerpts on Josephus, the foremost source often quoted by Christians, to prove their point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus_on_Jesus

Josephus on Jesus

There are two extant references in Josephus on Jesus, the one directly concerning Jesus has come to be known as the Testimonium Flavianum. These passages appear in The Antiquities of the Jews, written in the year 93 by the Jewish historian Josephus. All extant copies of this work, which all derive from Christian sources, even the recently recovered Arabic version, contain the two passages about Jesus. The authenticity of the Testimonium Flavianum has been disputed since the 17th century, and by the mid 18th century the consensus view was that it was a forgery. This conclusion was questioned in the 20th century and the intellectual controversy will probably never be resolved.

One of the earliest ecclesiastical authorities to condemn the Testimonium Flavianum as a forgery was Bishop Warburton of Gloucester (circa 1770). He described it as "a rank forgery, and a very stupid one, too." [27] Frank R. Zindler commented that Eusebius simply improved "the germ of the Testimonium (that) had already begun to infect certain Christian-copied versions of Antiquities of the Jews."
___________________________________________________________________________________________

The Christians friends are welcome for their comments; even if they differ.

Thanks

I love Jesus, Mary and Muhammad

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Jesus is not the same today

My Christian friend richmaffeobooks said:

“This question of the Real Presence, for me, revolves around the concept of the timelessness of eternity. I look at it this way, from our perspective, Jesus died some 2,000 years ago. But from God's perspective (because He is outside time and space) Jesus is STILL on the cross, (and He has not yet gone to the cross), because time is not linear in eternity. Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever because He is outside of linear time.”

Paarsurrey said:

I think this must be your opinion only. JesusYeshuaIssa, as you know according to Holger Kersten, a German Scholar did not die on Cross but he died a natural and peaceful death in Sirinagar, Kashmir, India at the age of 120 years ( not 33 years as is commonly believed). Now he is resting in the heavens as did Moses, he died and got buried and now he is resting in the heavens.

Also now Jesus' Second Coming has taken place in the form of the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908, so in my opinion, relevance of all such ideas doesn’t remain valid.

You say "Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever because He is outside of linear time". Kindly give straight passages from OTBible in support of your this claim and also for the reason , if any.

Please don't mind, I respect your faith.

Thanks

Antother Cahtolic friend adrift said:

“If this were true, which it is not, it would make Jesus a liar.”

Quote:
“Also now Jesus' Second Coming has taken place in the form of the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908, so in my opinion, relevance of all such ideas doesn’t remain valid.

There is no such thing as reincarnation this cannot be true.”

”Opinion should be based on truth.”

Paarsurrey said:

Hi

I respect your faith. I don't blame you, but the common man in your faith has been made to believe certain things which are not actually there. For instance, Jesus was never put in a grave, but you believe that he was put in a grave where even a healthy man whether one was earlier put on Cross or not would die. Jesus did not get resurrected from a grave, as he was never buried in grave.

He was laid in a tomb, which was spacious enough to accommodate two/three persons, it had a bigger opening which could be termed as a door and a smaller one that could be termed as a ventilator so that Jesus does not get suffocated there. This seems to be well thought of secret plan of Pilate who had held Jesus innocent and did not want that he should be killed on cross. Nicodimus, the physician brought an unusual quantity of herbs (fragrances) which were ingredients of a miraculous ointment later known in the ancient medical books as Ointment of Jesus or Ointment of Disciples which were applied on his body. Jesus was laid unconscious in the tomb but with this treatment he got cured in due course of time; and that fulfilled the Sign of Jonah of which Jesus had prophesized. So that is perhaps the reality of the events, I think.

You have the right to differ with me and you are welcome.

Jesus' Second Coming 1835-1908 is not that his spirit has entered literally in the body of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, the PromisedMessiah. This is not our concept, which would be much of a concept of Hinduism or Buddhism. Our concept is that as Jesus came into Judaism which were divided into many a cruel and hardened sects and Jesus was sent to soften them and unite them under his peaceful teachings, so is the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 to work for unity of faiths/denominations/religions of the world with peaceful means; well you can uderstand that this is not a smaller job.I think you agree with me. It is no difficult to understand.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful MuslimI am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

Jesus is not the same today

My Christian friend richmaffeobooks said:


“This question of the Real Presence, for me, revolves around the concept of the timelessness of eternity. I look at it this way, from our perspective, Jesus died some 2,000 years ago. But from God's perspective (because He is outside time and space) Jesus is STILL on the cross, (and He has not yet gone to the cross), because time is not linear in eternity. Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever because He is outside of linear time.”

Paarsurrey said:

I think this must be your opinion only. JesusYeshuaIssa, as you know according to Holger Kersten, a German Scholar did not die on Cross but he died a natural and peaceful death in Sirinagar, Kashmir, India at the age of 120 years ( not 33 years as is commonly believed). Now he is resting in the heavens as did Moses, he died and got buried and now he is resting in the heavens.

Also now Jesus' Second Coming has taken place in the form of the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908, so in my opinion, relevance of all such ideas doesn’t remain valid.

You say "Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever because He is outside of linear time". Kindly give straight passages from OTBible in support of your this claim and also for the reason , if any.

Please don't mind, I respect your faith.


Thanks

Antother Cahtolic friend adrift said:

“If this were true, which it is not, it would make Jesus a liar.”

Quote:

“Also now Jesus' Second Coming has taken place in the form of the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908, so in my opinion, relevance of all such ideas doesn’t remain valid.

There is no such thing as reincarnation this cannot be true.”

”Opinion should be based on truth.”

Paarsurrey said:

Hi

I respect your faith. I don't blame you, but the common man in your faith has been made to believe certain things which are not actually there. For instance, Jesus was never put in a grave, but you believe that he was put in a grave where even a healthy man whether one was earlier put on Cross or not would die. Jesus did not get resurrected from a grave, as he was never buried in grave.

He was laid in a tomb, which was spacious enough to accommodate two/three persons, it had a bigger opening which could be termed as a door and a smaller one that could be termed as a ventilator so that Jesus does not get suffocated there. This seems to be well thought of secret plan of Pilate who had held Jesus innocent and did not want that he should be killed on cross. Nicodimus, the physician brought an unusual quantity of herbs (fragrances) which were ingredients of a miraculous ointment later known in the ancient medical books as Ointment of Jesus or Ointment of Disciples which were applied on his body. Jesus was laid unconscious in the tomb but with this treatment he got cured in due course of time; and that fulfilled the Sign of Jonah of which Jesus had prophesized. So that is perhaps the reality of the events, I think.

You have the right to differ with me and you are welcome.

Jesus' Second Coming 1835-1908 is not that his spirit has entered literally in the body of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, the PromisedMessiah. This is not our concept, which would be much of a concept of Hinduism or Buddhism. Our concept is that as Jesus came into Judaism which were divided into many a cruel and hardened sects and Jesus was sent to soften them and unite them under his peaceful teachings, so is the PromisedMessiah 1835-1908 to work for unity of faiths/denominations/religions of the world with peaceful means; well you can uderstand that this is not a smaller job.I think you agree with me. It is no difficult to understand.

Thanks

I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim